hmm?

11/05/2012 07:17 PMPosted by Drakinn

Is the only way to get the Elder Charm Coins is by doing dailys by getting 90 of the good coins and turning them into 3 elder...? that sort of forces u into dailys if so.. because u know people want that extra chance in Raid to get the gear so your know there going do dailys to get a silly coin that doesnt even help one bit gg..

"Gear drops in raids like it always has."
"I like gear like I always have."
"But I want bonus chances at that gear."
"I have to do something to earn bonus chances at that gear?!"
"I don't want to do something to earn bonus chances at that gear!"
"That thing I don't want to do that would earn me bonus chances at that gear, doesn't earn me bonus chances at that gear!"

Let me know if that's an accurate summary, as well as what you're talking about. o.O

11/05/2012 07:35 PMPosted by Drakinn

Lol ok the point is everyone dont wanna do dailys all day every dam day : ) kk thanks. i dont mind grinding rep dont get me wrong gives me something to do... but having to do dailys to gain the rep is load of crap. tabard ftw.. gg.

Sounds good. I suggest not doing dailies all day everyday if you don't want to, then. I don't want to either. If I want to have additional pulls of the slot machine when I'm in a raid though, I'll decide if the cost is worth it, or if I'll just take my standard one shot at a boss's loot table per week.

Do I want a tabard that allows me to get credit for doing one type of content, while actually doing another (which, by itself, earns me gold and chances at loot)? It'd save me time, sure. There are so many things about endgame progression that could be changed to save me time, enough so that I wouldn't have to worry about enjoying actually playing the game to improve my character and earn things.

11/05/2012 07:50 PMPosted by Drakinn

Well you can still enjoy the game without as much grind : )

Finally we're in complete agreement, Drakinn!

...Even though I took that out of context and you're implying that you can't enjoy raiding unless you have multiple shots at a boss's loot table every week, which you should be entitled to under a method no one could possibly label as a "grind" -- a subjective term thrown around so much it's lost virtually all meaning...

11/05/2012 07:58 PMPosted by Drakinn

Well what if u dont raid at all not even with raid finder because u dont enjoying raiding because of all the numb skulls in the world.. then u have no other choice but to grind dailys and grind rep for VP gear. :D

Well, you've now completely negated the reason in your OP for not wanting to do the daily grind, since you've now removed raiding from the endgame content equation.

So, being as fair as I possibly can, this is the direction your argument is headed:

"What if I don't want to choose to do option A (scenarios), option B (dungeons), option C (raids), or option D (BGs/arenas)? You're now forcing me to choose option E!"

And that's excluding pet battles, dungeon challenges, player farms, professions, Transmog runs, etc.

11/05/2012 08:01 PMPosted by Dysheki

Sounds good. I suggest not doing dailies all day everyday if you don't want to, then. I don't want to either.

Zarhym admits he/she doesn't want to do dailies. What can we infer out of this? Devs admit they aren't fun. Which they aren't.

Maybe once. Maybe twice. Heck, I'll even go three times. But past that? Pfffffft.

I don't like it when my words are twisted. I put sentences together to convey a cohesive thought, so I'd prefer if you read them in context.

I said I don't want to do dailies all day everyday either. I do dailies. I enjoy being able to earn my reputation. I appreciate that the system is designed to allow me to do a little bit of whatever I want to do each week without feeling overwhelmed. As soon as I capped Valor this week, I stopped running dailies and focused on other things. I'll wait until the weekly reset to pick up where I left off to get the full reward of completing each daily. Those factions aren't going anywhere. I log into the game everyday, and I never log out feeling like I made no progress. I can't say the same about my time in Cataclysm.

11/05/2012 08:25 PMPosted by Onionrings

I appreciate that the system is designed to allow me to do a little bit of whatever I want to do each week without feeling overwhelmed.

Except it is overwhelming. Every day I don't finish all of my dailies, I feel like I've missed out. That I'm now behind where I could be. And how do I catch up? I don't. I'll never catch up, I'll always be behind. This puts an overwhelming burden on completing every daily every day. And each day I don't meet these goals set by the game, it's demotivating. Why keep trying since I'll never catch up?

My valor is capped for the week, my charms are capped for the next several weeks, and every post I make or read I'm feeling more and more behind schedule. But I've fallen so far behind now, that I don't want to try and catch up.

Just like with all other games I play, I don't choose to measure how my time is spent in the game -- or whether or not I'm enjoying it -- against the players in STARS, Vodka, Blood Legion, or any of the other hardcore guilds out there, or the people who can devote hours upon hours more time to this game than me.

I don't think you should either. Sure, I know people have commitments to friends and guilds. There are social expectations and demands put on players to be at a certain progression point, or completing X/Y/Z every week in order to be included in raids.

If the goal is to be entertained by playing a game and you're not meeting that goal, it's totally fair to reassess things -- whether that means looking at what kind of stresses you impose on yourself, who you're playing with, what you're doing with your time in the game, and maybe even your time spent with the game itself.

But, from your post, it sounds like the pressure you feel comes from within. And I honestly have to wonder why. I don't mean to be a downer, but you'll likely never be on the cutting edge of clearing content as soon as it's possible to do so. And by the way, these endgame progression systems weren't modeled around that being the assumed standard way the general population plays the game. Spoiler: It's not how the general population plays the game.

Leading up to Mists, we talked a lot about having as many options as possible for players to play how they want to. That means you have a lot of choices, and some of them will provide you with extra advantages in other pieces of content (bonus rolls, VP loot from factions, etc.). Regardless of your opinion on our delivery, I think it's fair to say we really did give people a lot of choices. But if the standard mentality is, "I must do ALL THE THINGS if I can," rather than, "I must do all the things I find fun that will progress my character, time permitting" you'll surely feel overwhelmed.

11/05/2012 08:32 PMPosted by Skyborn

The whole "coin" thing is fine but I know have 274 lesser charm of good fortune and 9 elder charm of good fortune! WTH am I gonna do with all these lesser ones? Can't trade them in, not yet geared enough for raids(spending way too much time doing dailies with no time left for heroics!)!!!! So what good are they other then taking up space(2slots) in my bag?!?!?!

Lesser Charms are being moved out of your bags and turned into a currency in 5.1. Think a little further down the road when you're not doing dailies as often and you're raiding more. A stockpile of Lesser Charms is absolutely what you'll want. ;)

He's a CM responding to a player who wasn't acting very professional. After days of seeing posts by people, trying their hardest to convince people that "dailies are forced on everyone". Poking holes into you alls "forced" theory, in a language you understand and speak fluently, was very appropriate.

He even told you theorists how to manage your time better... I would think a thank you is the correct response.

=D

I think what should be taken out of the responses of those players frustrated at the CMs response is the standard of discourse that is being set, through said CM, in threads like this.

A CM is blizzards representative on these forums and the closest we come to hearing/seeing information straight from "the horses mouth". Now the wow forums are at times very cynical and baiting/trolling can be rife, but for a CM to come into a thread (one that didn't dignify a response) and basically condone certain behaviours through both the language he used and the context he used it in is quite disgraceful and reflects pretty poorly on both blizzard and the CM team.

It is up to the CM, not the players, to set the standard when it comes to meaningful debate and conversation. Showing otherwise further condones bad behaviour and meaningless posts in this thread and others all over general.

That's a fair point and I'll honestly think about that more as I'm flipping through the front page of the forums.

This is also a good time to remind people you can email [email protected] with your thoughts on our methods of community engagement. The posts in this thread commenting on my performance as a Community Manager, positive or negative, are better sent to my superiors so the topic of the thread stays on course. You can also personally give me feedback or chat with me on Twitter: @CM_Zarhym. I promise I at least read every tweet, and respond as often as I can. ;)